Canadian Election Results

[Don Alaska]

It appears that the Liberal Party has trounced the Conservative Party in Canada, but perhaps not have a majority, so there will likely be a Left-Wing coalition form. Who knows what this means. Did Trump affect the election there with his comments about the "51st State"? Alberta has a strong independence movement forming after 4 consecutive Liberal election wins. Alberta is the most conservative of the Canadian provinces and forms, I think, about half of the Canadian economy. If Alberta holds a referendum and chooses to leave Canada, the U.S. could begin to negotiate statehood for it or simply announce that it is recognizing Alberta as an independent nation and form diplomatic relations with Edmonton. The latter would be the easiest choice and there is little Canada could do about it. Canada couldn't really go to war with the U.S. to keep Alberta. It does have the resources. Such a move could encourage Saskatchewan to follow suit, and Quebec, long considering independence, might also separate. Canada would fall apart and the tradition of a great nation would fall apart.

 

[Axel Slingerland]

Canada couldn't really go to war with the U.S. to keep Alberta. It does have the resources.

Canada couldn't go to war with the U.S. at all. Just considering the military, we have them out-manned 19 to 1. We have 2 Million soldiers (all branches of the US Military, including the Reserves) vs. 100,000 Canadian soldiers. And that's just the soldiers. We have far more hardware than Canada as well. It would be foolish for Canada to pursue military action. That war could be over in a matter of hours.

However, the US imports a ton of stuff from Canada that we can't live without. Such as including almost all of our Natural Gas, approximately 60% of Crude oil and about of our electricity comes from Canada. So no, it's wouldn't be a military war. If Canada cut off the US, Trump's Trade War could severely cripple the country. And not just with Canada either. The US simply can't survive without imports.

A lot of that is our own fault, the government allowed big companies to shut down American factories in favor of cheaper offshore labor. Then the people supported that move by buying the imported goods instead of American Made goods. Now, very little is made here. And what is made here is typically more expensive, forcing many people to continue buying imported goods.

Those of us that opposed that move were labled with such silly names as Bleeding Heart Tree Hugging Liberals. But while the rich is stockpiling money, which will be useless when there's nothing to buy, some of us Bleeding Heart Tree Hugging Liberals learned how to survive without money. I'm too old for that now, but 30 years ago, I could have lived off the land quite well. But now, living in the woods would be quite difficult in a wheelchair...

 

[Jacob Petersheim]

However, the US imports a ton of stuff from Canada that we can't live without. Such as including almost all of our Natural Gas, approximately 60% of Crude oil and about of our electricity comes from Canada. So no, it's wouldn't be a military war. If Canada cut off the US, Trump's Trade War could severely cripple the country. And not just with Canada either. The US simply can't survive without imports.

Huh?

Most of the petroleum fractions the US buys from Canada is at a pretty steep discount. The natural gas is actually at pretty low volume. Domestically produced gas is being shipped from the US to the UK and elsewhere, since there is plenty of domestic production. The crude oil is nasty low-grade stuff, very sour (sulfur), and Canada needs to dump it because they lack facilities to process the gunk. Much of what they do process cleans it just enough to run more freely through pipelines to the US for proper processing into useful products.

Electricity? Um, nope. The hilarious threat from Ontario quickly evaporated when the clown Doug Ford was informed that Canadian electricity flowing through US grid almost entirely does so to provide a backup path for Ontario's weak overtaxed infrastructure. It goes into the US and then back to Canada. I doubt anyone but maybe New York uses any significant amount of it - at a discount.

Pulpwood and softwood dimension lumber is imported by the US, but mainly because Canada produces it under subsidies that undermine domestic production. The US ends up exporting as much lumber as it imports from Canada. Insane, but that's NAFTA for you.

 

[Jacob Petersheim]

Canada should be thrilled to have yet another round of Trudeauism.

No more pesky English and French, soon they'll all be speaking Chinese!

 

[Susannah]

Did Trump affect the election there with his comments about the "51st State"? Alberta has a strong independence movement forming after 4 consecutive Liberal election wins. Alberta is the most conservative of the Canadian provinces and forms, I think, about half of the Canadian economy. If Alberta holds a referendum and chooses to leave Canada, the U.S. could begin to negotiate statehood for it or simply announce that it is recognizing Alberta as an independent nation and form diplomatic relations with Edmonton. The latter would be the easiest choice and there is little Canada could do about it. Canada couldn't really go to war with the U.S. to keep Alberta. It does have the resources. Such a move could encourage Saskatchewan to follow suit, and Quebec, long considering independence, might also separate. Canada would fall apart and the tradition of a great nation would fall apart.

The liberals here say Trump affected the election and maybe he did. It was one of those crazy things that there’s no reason to say that make enemies instead of friends. On the other hand, I’d hate to be so weak minded that the leader of another country could change my vote but maybe they are. I don’t want Alberta. I want to strengthen the northern border and tighten the rules for anyone to cross it. And I want to Canada to play fair for a change.

Canada couldn't go to war with the U.S. at all. Just considering the military, we have them out-manned 19 to 1. We have 2 Million soldiers (all branches of the US Military, including the Reserves) vs. 100,000 Canadian soldiers. And that's just the soldiers. We have far more hardware than Canada as well. It would be foolish for Canada to pursue military action. That war could be over in a matter of hours.

However, the US imports a ton of stuff from Canada that we can't live without. Such as including almost all of our Natural Gas, approximately 60% of Crude oil and about of our electricity comes from Canada. So no, it's wouldn't be a military war. If Canada cut off the US, Trump's Trade War could severely cripple the country. And not just with Canada either. The US simply can't survive without imports.

A lot of that is our own fault, the government allowed big companies to shut down American factories in favor of cheaper offshore labor. Then the people supported that move by buying the imported goods instead of American Made goods. Now, very little is made here. And what is made here is typically more expensive, forcing many people to continue buying imported goods.

Those of us that opposed that move were labled with such silly names as Bleeding Heart Tree Hugging Liberals. But while the rich is stockpiling money, which will be useless when there's nothing to buy, some of us Bleeding Heart Tree Hugging Liberals learned how to survive without money. I'm too old for that now, but 30 years ago, I could have lived off the land quite well. But now, living in the woods would be quite difficult in a wheelchair...

It’s time for Canada to actually engage in fair trade and stop expecting the US to defend them and pay for it too. They would have been taken over by Russia a long time ago if it weren’t for us. As far as stuff countries can’t live without they literally would not live without our defense forces.

Canada should be thrilled to have yet another round of Trudeauism.

No more pesky English and French, soon they'll all be speaking Chinese!

Jacob wins the best quote of the thread only they might be speaking Russian if China appoints Putin to oversee them.

 

[Jacob Petersheim]

Even ignoring everything related to the US, Canada has a lot of serious problems.

Even higher housing costs, high unemployment and a homelessness and drug use problem approaching California proportions. The abusive "apportionment" scheme that funnels money from productive parts of the country to Quebec and the big cities. Centrally managed "news" and a continuing jihad on free speech. Immigration, legal and illegal, and rising crime rates. An economy almost entirely dependent on imports.

 

[Susannah]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1917635083764216186

 

[Don Alaska]

Huh?

Most of the petroleum fractions the US buys from Canada is at a pretty steep discount. The natural gas is actually at pretty low volume. Domestically produced gas is being shipped from the US to the UK and elsewhere, since there is plenty of domestic production. The crude oil is nasty low-grade stuff, very sour (sulfur), and Canada needs to dump it because they lack facilities to process the gunk. Much of what they do process cleans it just enough to run more freely through pipelines to the US for proper processing into useful products.

Electricity? Um, nope. The hilarious threat from Ontario quickly evaporated when the clown Doug Ford was informed that Canadian electricity flowing through US grid almost entirely does so to provide a backup path for Ontario's weak overtaxed infrastructure. It goes into the US and then back to Canada. I doubt anyone but maybe New York uses any significant amount of it - at a discount.

Pulpwood and softwood dimension lumber is imported by the US, but mainly because Canada produces it under subsidies that undermine domestic production. The US ends up exporting as much lumber as it imports from Canada. Insane, but that's NAFTA for you.

All very true. My war comment was tongue-in-cheek as Canada could not defend its provinces if it wanted to do so, as their military is almost non-existent. Actually, there is provision in Canadian law that allows provinces to secede, and the process is governed by the provincial legislature. I just watched a lawyer in Canada explain the entire process. The ability to secede has apparently existed since Canada became independent, but the process was clarified during the attempt by Quebec to leave Canada some decades ago. We'll see what happens. If I were an Albertan, I would vote for independence and ask the U.S. for strong affiliation. I would not go for statehood until I determined for sure the conditions of acceptance. Alaska has a statehood contract, but it has been violated by the Federal government almost since we were accepted as a state.

 

[Jacob Petersheim]

Canada seems far closer to a split than the US has been since events leading up to the Civil War.

It seems that Alberta is pulling out of the Canada Pension Plan and now its neighbors are joining in. Even BC is caving, and for that matter much of Ontario outside of the bigger cities. They are even discussing a Western National Bank and their own military.

I suppose the election was the last straw.

Ottawa in Panic: Western Provinces Unite After Alberta’s CPP Exit

 

[Axel Slingerland]

I would choose sides with Western Canada. Just like I have always joked that I-25 is the border between the US in the east and America in the west, if I-25 were to continue north, in approximately the same general area, with the Plains to the east and the Rockies to the west of Canada, I don't know what they would call it, but the west would be better off.

 

[Jacob Petersheim]

I just saw that the video has been tagged "altered or synthetic content" by YouTube. That wasn't there when I first viewed the video.

However, listening again, it does sound like a robot voice reading from a script. Sorry if this is really just some "old news" about theoretical moves repackaged as a report of new deliberate action.

 

[Jacob Petersheim]

It sounds as if Saskatchewan and Alberta are making a stronger case to become part of the US. Whether this will ever happen or whether it is more of a negotiation tactic to get a better deal from Ottawa isn't clear to me. It sounds as if becoming an independent nation is on the table as well.

Saskatchewan and Alberta Drop a 51st and 52nd State BOMBSHELL That SHOCKS Canada!

One way or another this doesn't seem to be going away any time soon.

 

[Don Alaska]

I don't think it would be in anyone's interest for them to become states, but they could become independent nations or together form one country that could negotiate with both Canada and the U.S. for the best deals on any number of things. Statehood contracts mean nothing to the Feds, as someone in Alaska can attest. Congress violates statehood contracts at will, but sends money here that will keep us a dependent of the U.S. As an independent nation, they could apply for membership in the UN if so desired and even form their own currency.

 

[Jacob Petersheim]

If they left, Canada would collapse. The East is substantially funded by the work and resource exploitation of the prairie provinces. Mainly oil and agriculture.

Very similar to the colonial attitude of the coasts and other big cities toward the bulk of America.

 

[Don Alaska]

The exploitation is the biggest issue in Canada, and has become a big issue in the U.S. as well.

 

[Jacob Petersheim]

Yes, it is hard to watch the world you knew get logged off, stripped, polluted, etc. as the spoils in products and profits are not even fairly shared. It adds insult to injury. On top of that you get explicit insult: those reaping unfair shares of the pillaging tend to be vocal about their disdain for people living in the "donor" regions, and impose rules on how they should live and "know their place."